Tad Williams' Message Board

Hello, babies. Welcome to Earth. It's hot in the summer and cold in the winter. It's round and wet and crowded. At the outside, babies, you've got about a hundred years here. There's only one rule that I know of, babies -- 'God damn it, you've got to be kind.'
-    Kurt Vonnegut, 1922-2007

Welcome to the message board for tadwilliams.com. All comments are welcome, whether kudos or brickbats. However, please bear in mind that Tad would like this to be a friendly, civil message board, at least in the relations between users. We reserve the right to remove postings, or even ban postings, from anyone who crosses the boundary of reasonable taste. Basically, you can argue vigorously with someone, but watch your language, okay? We have a lot of young readers as well as grown-ups, so please show them some respect.

But the main requirement here is: have fun.


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#1 2008-10-11 06:56:50

strangeshe
Hierarch
From: Texas
Registered: 2001-06-04
Posts: 11555

More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

 

#2 2008-10-11 08:27:39

Earthmanu
Pilgrim
From: France - near PARIS - Marly-le
Registered: 2002-01-13
Posts: 291

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

I have seen the interview.

It is great to watch Tad's enthousiasm about the whole project.

I hope that they will manage to keep "creeping parts" without losing the non-adult (teenaged) public.


- My former pseudo in the french minitel roleplaying community AKELA
was "GAG THE FOOL" , for about one thousand hours ...
- I wish to share experience about
1/writing rpg-scenarii in Tolkien's Beleriand ... 2/teaching roleplay and impro to disabled adolescents ... 3/simulations of acrobatic kites flying

 

#3 2008-10-23 18:12:14

strangeshe
Hierarch
From: Texas
Registered: 2001-06-04
Posts: 11555

 

#4 2008-11-11 09:49:31

Kiema
Pilgrim
Registered: 2004-12-29
Posts: 565

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

So, was flipping through my PC Gamer magazine this morning and lo and behold there was an article about Otherland MMO.  The final paragraph by the reporter Tony Ellis states:  "I could end on the customary cautious note here and say that [being wildly ambitious] might be their downfall.  But screw that kind of miserablist thinking.  Frankly, Otherland deserves to succeed precisely because it's trying to do something new and exciting.  I'm rooting for it."

This may be somewhere else, too, but the environs of Otherland will be rendered in 1080p -- a first for an MMO.  2010 seems so far away.

 

#5 2008-11-17 07:16:32

pixiejen
Pilgrim
From: At my desk
Registered: 2008-01-18
Posts: 95
Website

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

Well as far as I'm concerned it doesn't have to be a WoW killer at all -- it just has to make a nice and tidy profit for Tad.  I'll sure as hell play it.


I also play WoW in a 100+ person raiding guild.  I'll spread the word :p   Most everyone I've spoken to that plays MMOs has read Otherland anyway!


"When the windows of perception are cleansed, man will see the universe as it truly is - infinite."

-W. Blake.

pixiejen.com

 

#6 2008-11-25 14:15:07

ArcticSwan360
Pilgrim
From: Minnesota
Registered: 2004-11-06
Posts: 1075
Website

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

I disagree, it definitely has to be a WOW-killer. If WOW continues to remain supreme we won't see innovative MMOs that are successful, but will keep on seeing the same-old/same-old. And if things go as planned, I hope it lead to more games based of Tad's works. It would be cool to see a War of the Flowers game where you play an original character that discovers the world.


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#7 2008-12-04 11:45:13

Valandur
Pilgrim
From: The Swamps of Louisiana
Registered: 2008-12-04
Posts: 6

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

Greetings,

I've been following the posts and info that's being released on Otherland.  I've been playing online games since before they added graphics to games, and I've grown quite tired of how all the new games have been "babyfied" with no penalty for death, or stupid decisions. The info posted on Massively is very happily received..

"A Virtual currency will exist and artifacts and money should play a part. When a player dies objects can be taken from them and sold at the Mars black market. Otherland MMO is still a way out and will not launch for awhile. The tentative release date is 2010"

This statement alone is wonderful, no longer will people be able to run through all the games content within a couple of months then commence to whining about how there is nothing new for them to do. This will bring a sense of accomplishment, a aspect of actual danger back to gaming, that in my not so humble opinion, online games have been severely lacking! 

"Each player experiences their own unique story with the game dynamically changing. Avatars start in Lambda Mall and explore this virtual shopping and theme zone filled with entertainment. Outside of the Lambda Mall you are no longer protected by the no combat safe zone."

With such a large area of the game set in a manner where potential for a player to run afowl of others, people will be forced to either travel in groups, or take more care in what they do or where they go.

What I am anxious to know is how 'they' will handle Middle Country.  Will they try to create the MC world from scratch?  Or will they try to drop a prepackaged game into the Otherland realm?  Here with the concept of your 'character' actually dieing, it will be much easier to create Middle Country.  I have been giving it a bit of consideration and I believe that it's possible to create the game within a game that MC should actually be. 

I can't wait for the official site and even more, the official Beta signup!  :)


Edit:  After watching the Vid interview, I have to ask...  Where was the interview conducted? The object on the wall behind Tad Williams looks suspiciously like some form of airlock? 

  Regards,

  Valandur

Last edited by Valandur (2008-12-04 12:14:32)


For neither man nor angel can discern
Hypocrisy-the only evil that walks invisible....
-Milton,Paradise Lost, iii:682-684

 

#8 2008-12-06 00:17:19

ArcticSwan360
Pilgrim
From: Minnesota
Registered: 2004-11-06
Posts: 1075
Website

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

technically the Middle Country isn't part of the Otherland network as far as I've read so far. For all we know the game might be just dealing with the Otherland network and Lambda Mall, no other online sections. However, I think it would be a serious mistake or missed opportunity to leave that out.


http://thewritersguild.spaces.live.com/

I'd greatly appreciate comments on my blog.
It will be about reading, writing, gaming, movies, tv and more.
Thank You, and rember: Join Today! The Guild Needs You!

 

#9 2008-12-09 10:23:45

Valandur
Pilgrim
From: The Swamps of Louisiana
Registered: 2008-12-04
Posts: 6

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

ArcticSwan360, I'm in agreement with you on Middle Country, to leave it out would, (IMO) cut off many potential players of the Otherland game as a whole.

While I've always been a fan of  D&D type games, I'm not adverse to tech or future games at all, I think it would be excellent to be able to wander through Lamda Mall for a while, then head to Middle Country and hack some monsters apart for a bit. =D

I was rereading a piece that TenTonHammer did on Otherland..

http://www.tentonhammer.com/node/45352

And in it they said One fairly serious concern at this point is whether or not new players will feel a real sense of attachment to the Tron-like Simuloids with which you start the game

To this I say How can you feel attachment to a dorky Night Elf with massive floppy ears???  Or a Undead creature with no lower jaw??  This is not a serious concern by my way of thinking.  Not only will 'we' be able to upgrade our sims, and give them more detail etc..  But when everyone else is running around in beginner sims, then you see someone go by with a older, really wicked looking sim, that alone will make you want to keep playing!

Another thing mentioned in the writeup is..  The game will be more like a collection of worlds distinct in every way - from races, quests, everything down to how your character develops in each world

By this statement and what I've read in a few other sites, I am speculating that not only will we have a 'Core' character, say our Main, that exists in Lamda and those beginning areas.  But we will have different characters as we venture onto different 'realms', 'worlds'?

  Either that or we will have our main character, then when we enter the Otherland network, we will  be given a persona or character either for that world, or for the whole Otherland network.  Those questions are likely some that will be answered fairly soon. (I hope) :P

I am very interested in how they will handle 'Hacking' in Otherland.  In order for it to be complex and interesting, they will have to create a skill system that enables people to learn and get better, but hopefully won't be boring, or too repetitive.

After playing most all of the MMO's that have come out, I am so sick of seeing these Npc's standing around with big icons over their heads indicating to all that "Here I am, come get a quest from me".  I think it would be much better if there were no Signs pointing to quest givers, and the only way of getting quests from Npc's would be to talk to them, and not all would give you a quest the first time you spoke to them, some might need a keyword, or some might not give a quest until you speak to them say 3 times, then they get mad and tell you to "Go find XXXX, he was looking for someone to do a job for him".   

Another avenue that seems to be lacking in games today are obscure clues in either books, papers, graffiti, or even pictures.  Quests should not be easy, some should be downright hard to complete, not because there is a horde of monsters guarding it, but because you have to piece together clues and talk to people etc..

  I'm likely wrong about much of what I'm saying, but I've been involved in beta testing since Daoc was being created and I think with the Author being involved, Otherland should be a excellent game!

  Regards,

Valandur


For neither man nor angel can discern
Hypocrisy-the only evil that walks invisible....
-Milton,Paradise Lost, iii:682-684

 

#10 2008-12-09 10:41:53

Wolfshade
Pilgrim
From: Warwick, RI
Registered: 2001-06-04
Posts: 3468
Website

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

Valandur wrote:

After playing most all of the MMO's that have come out, I am so sick of seeing these Npc's standing around with big icons over their heads indicating to all that "Here I am, come get a quest from me".  I think it would be much better if there were no Signs pointing to quest givers, and the only way of getting quests from Npc's would be to talk to them, and not all would give you a quest the first time you spoke to them, some might need a keyword, or some might not give a quest until you speak to them say 3 times, then they get mad and tell you to "Go find XXXX, he was looking for someone to do a job for him".

The icons are part of the evolution of MMOs.  While there might be a more subtle way to indicate quests, the method of having to figure out who to talk to and when leads to successful players having to spend more time on info web sites than in game, trying to figure out where to go.  This seperates the player from the game more than the icons do, by far.


"The rhythm is broken by continuous illumination, continuous darkness, or by decapitation." M.Morita and J.B.Best. The Journal of Experimental Zoology. 231: 273-282 (1984)

http://twitter.com/wolfshade
http://www.fullcastpodcast.com

 

#11 2008-12-09 12:28:20

Valandur
Pilgrim
From: The Swamps of Louisiana
Registered: 2008-12-04
Posts: 6

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

Wolfshade wrote:

The icons are part of the evolution of MMOs.  While there might be a more subtle way to indicate quests, the method of having to figure out who to talk to and when leads to successful players having to spend more time on info web sites than in game, trying to figure out where to go.  This seperates the player from the game more than the icons do, by far.

True, I suppose I was longing for a time when games weren't broken down piece by piece on web sites.  There are alternate ways of making quests and such not always exactly the same, dynamic quests that aren't given by the same person everytime, or quests who's contact person(s) change. Or quest requirements could change.

I guess I'm seeking a game that has not been oversimplified.  I don't know how many remember EQ1, back when it came out there were no other games like it, so you either played, or you didn't.  Many people hated the death penalty, the faction system, but now after games like Wow making things so easy, the thought of having a game that you can't solo your way to the top is appealing.

  Regards,

  Valandur


For neither man nor angel can discern
Hypocrisy-the only evil that walks invisible....
-Milton,Paradise Lost, iii:682-684

 

#12 2008-12-13 12:30:54

Ruts
Pilgrim
Registered: 2008-05-02
Posts: 6

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

While I agree that many games today are over simplified, what I really think is stupid is the fact that you very rarely get to make any important decisions about your character. You can rarely do anything that really defines your character and makes it different from others. Everyone with the same profession can pretty much do exactly the same things. That is something I find very boring, and it feels like there's only as many different characters as there are different professions. I really hope this game will force ppl to make serious decisions about their characters so that the population of the game becomes more diverse.

Just my 2 cents.

 

#13 2008-12-16 07:31:34

Valandur
Pilgrim
From: The Swamps of Louisiana
Registered: 2008-12-04
Posts: 6

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

Ruts wrote:

While I agree that many games today are over simplified, what I really think is stupid is the fact that you very rarely get to make any important decisions about your character. You can rarely do anything that really defines your character and makes it different from others. Everyone with the same profession can pretty much do exactly the same things. That is something I find very boring, and it feels like there's only as many different characters as there are different professions. I really hope this game will force ppl to make serious decisions about their characters so that the population of the game becomes more diverse.

I totally agree!  In the MMO Warhammer Age of Reckoning, they were going to institute aging of characters as they progressed,  but it turned out to be too complex so they had to toss the idea.  Otherland would have no need of that feature being as you will have a 'sim' and not a character.  But they could go with a free form skill tree, so that instead of making a Thief, or a Wizard, you could choose skills that suit you and not be locked into 1 class.  That would make everyone unique. (Or those that didn't follow a template anyway).


  I'm holding to the belief that with the Author being a part of the creation of Otherland the MMO, that it will not simply fall in line with the standard MMO template of the current games out now.

  Regards,

  Valandur


For neither man nor angel can discern
Hypocrisy-the only evil that walks invisible....
-Milton,Paradise Lost, iii:682-684

 

#14 2008-12-28 04:23:11

Ruts
Pilgrim
Registered: 2008-05-02
Posts: 6

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

I hope you get your wish, Valandur, because mine is similar. :)

Last edited by Ruts (2008-12-28 04:24:20)

 

#15 2008-12-29 13:58:14

Wolfshade
Pilgrim
From: Warwick, RI
Registered: 2001-06-04
Posts: 3468
Website

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

I think this trend is driven by the market.  In WoW, the goal is always slightly improving gear, and while there are quite a few possible individual choices in speccing a character (I agree more would be good) if one allows for a slightly higher dps (damage per second) than any others, you will be required to spec that way to join a raid and will be chastized for not having discovered the this spec on your own.  As a result, the fringe specs and talent choices go virtually unused.  I think the way to break that trend is to somehow break with the traditional form of combat.  If there was a more multilayered rock/papers/scissors type of fighting scheme, it might be advantageous to be different from others.  I also think that the different trade skills in WoW should result in very different and very significant benefits.  Right now, the benefits are fairly minor, and all players end up wearing the same exact raid/pvp gear as everyone else with little exception.

I would love to see more variablility.  The way to acheive it is by having different strategies to acheive the same end.  If one is easier or more effective than the others, everyone has to either be like everyone else or be discluded from the high end content.


"The rhythm is broken by continuous illumination, continuous darkness, or by decapitation." M.Morita and J.B.Best. The Journal of Experimental Zoology. 231: 273-282 (1984)

http://twitter.com/wolfshade
http://www.fullcastpodcast.com

 

#16 2008-12-29 23:31:53

Ad1tu
Pilgrim
From: Buffysadharc
Registered: 2004-02-22
Posts: 6334

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

It seems to me that WoW and Otherland, while both MMOs, will have completely different purposes for why people play the game. Otherland is, it seems, more of a "create a 'real' person and do people stuff" with some unknown end-game goal, I suppose, maybe something as simple as survive or as complex as the actual story line. People who play WoW do it for 2 reasons: Raiding and Arenas. I personally do it for raiding because I like seeing the storyline (I'm doing Wyrmrest Temple quests right now, sooo cool!) and raiding means seeing "the end" sort of. Will Otherland have a definite end? Or will it be more open like Oblivion or Fallout 3? Yes, you can follow the main quest line, but there's TONS of other stuff to do that will keep you busy for hours upon hours.
Also, Valandur mentioned about quests being too easy... WoW is aimed at the masses, and the masses don't want complicated things to do, they want (semi)mindless entertainment. Thus the reason it has been such a success. I tried EQ2, but not only did it run like $&*# on my poor laptop, I have a tendency to die a lot and the xp reduction made it feel like I would never progress anywhere. In WoW, you (almost) always know where to go next and what you have to do. I'm okay with it. I'd honestly rather have the big exclamation mark over the head rather than having to run around and talk to everyone in the right order. (Although I must agree, when they put the marks over the wanted posters, that was too much.) Of course, this again goes along with definite ending or open environment type of game. WoW vs. Oblivion.
And Wolfshade.. I'll never forget the day I was told, TOLD, to go respec 10 min before raid time to change *2* of my talent points around. Again, if there were more things to do at max level besides raid and arena, I think we'd see more variation in talent trees.


If you should do what makes you happy, and no one can tell you what makes you happy, then that means no one can tell you what to do!

Tamishu's Ramblings

 

#17 2008-12-30 07:39:26

Earthmanu
Pilgrim
From: France - near PARIS - Marly-le
Registered: 2002-01-13
Posts: 291

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

A very complete article about the OTHERLAND MMO, written by Carolyn Koh for IGN three monthes ago but rich!

http://uk.pc.ign.com/articles/915/915261p1.html


- My former pseudo in the french minitel roleplaying community AKELA
was "GAG THE FOOL" , for about one thousand hours ...
- I wish to share experience about
1/writing rpg-scenarii in Tolkien's Beleriand ... 2/teaching roleplay and impro to disabled adolescents ... 3/simulations of acrobatic kites flying

 

#18 2009-01-06 17:14:00

Cho Cho
Pilgrim
Registered: 2008-05-17
Posts: 18

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

Anything new yet?

 

#19 2009-01-09 23:20:01

ArcticSwan360
Pilgrim
From: Minnesota
Registered: 2004-11-06
Posts: 1075
Website

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

How about this: http://www.vuzix.com/iwear/products_wrap920av.html

Can you imagine how much immersion you'd get with that?


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I'd greatly appreciate comments on my blog.
It will be about reading, writing, gaming, movies, tv and more.
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#20 2009-01-16 14:31:54

Ruts
Pilgrim
Registered: 2008-05-02
Posts: 6

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

That was a really nice article, Earthmanu. Hope they continue to keep tabs on it.

 

#21 2009-01-16 15:46:24

ArcticSwan360
Pilgrim
From: Minnesota
Registered: 2004-11-06
Posts: 1075
Website

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

Yeah, it was a good article, I read it a long time ago. The comments of the boards drove me a little insane from what I remember, none of them knew what they were talking about. Anyone check out those virtual sunglasses?


http://thewritersguild.spaces.live.com/

I'd greatly appreciate comments on my blog.
It will be about reading, writing, gaming, movies, tv and more.
Thank You, and rember: Join Today! The Guild Needs You!

 

#22 2009-01-19 23:05:44

Cho Cho
Pilgrim
Registered: 2008-05-17
Posts: 18

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

ArcticSwan360 wrote:

Yeah, it was a good article, I read it a long time ago. The comments of the boards drove me a little insane from what I remember, none of them knew what they were talking about. Anyone check out those virtual sunglasses?

Yeah well, quite don't like the fact that you still see your surroundings. Would find that disturbing to see through an interface while playing.

 

#23 2009-01-21 13:50:20

ArcticSwan360
Pilgrim
From: Minnesota
Registered: 2004-11-06
Posts: 1075
Website

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

I think you can set it so you don't see that, a type of transparency setting for when your walking or on the bus.


http://thewritersguild.spaces.live.com/

I'd greatly appreciate comments on my blog.
It will be about reading, writing, gaming, movies, tv and more.
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#24 2009-03-27 11:46:58

strangeshe
Hierarch
From: Texas
Registered: 2001-06-04
Posts: 11555

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

This just in: Otherland: 14 new screens

This came to my attention from an alert I have set up, so all I know is what is right there at the link. Have no idea if Tad's seen the new screens or not. (Tad's been offline for most of the week due to tech probs as explained in the DogBlog.)

I'll see if I can find out anything more & will update News if so.

 

#25 2009-03-29 12:47:12

ArcticSwan360
Pilgrim
From: Minnesota
Registered: 2004-11-06
Posts: 1075
Website

Re: More news on the OTHERLAND MMO

My favorite might be the one with the avatar sliding down the neon-blue wire on his feet. Can't wait any longer, must play now!


http://thewritersguild.spaces.live.com/

I'd greatly appreciate comments on my blog.
It will be about reading, writing, gaming, movies, tv and more.
Thank You, and rember: Join Today! The Guild Needs You!

 

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