Tad Williams' Message Board

Hello, babies. Welcome to Earth. It's hot in the summer and cold in the winter. It's round and wet and crowded. At the outside, babies, you've got about a hundred years here. There's only one rule that I know of, babies -- 'God damn it, you've got to be kind.'
-    Kurt Vonnegut, 1922-2007

Welcome to the message board for tadwilliams.com. All comments are welcome, whether kudos or brickbats. However, please bear in mind that Tad would like this to be a friendly, civil message board, at least in the relations between users. We reserve the right to remove postings, or even ban postings, from anyone who crosses the boundary of reasonable taste. Basically, you can argue vigorously with someone, but watch your language, okay? We have a lot of young readers as well as grown-ups, so please show them some respect.

But the main requirement here is: have fun.


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#151 2003-06-27 18:24:00

Libbette
Pilgrim
Registered: 2001-06-29
Posts: 13415

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

There are many great Indian movies.

 

#152 2003-06-27 18:27:00

Damon
Pilgrim
From: enzed
Registered: 2001-05-31
Posts: 10673
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

They're not easy to get through university, though. We have lots of French, German, Spanish, Chinese, and Japanese films because all of those languages are taught here, but Indian's much harder to come by.


Damon.co.nz: Where the homeless come to bathe
"Pardon me while I have a strange interlude."

 

#153 2003-06-27 18:27:00

bandit
Pilgrim
From: Auckland
Registered: 2002-11-13
Posts: 4134
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

I like Salaam Bombay. Eisenstein - are you seeing The Battleship Potemkin (sp?)?


Crow: I think Ray Liotta would make an okay werewolf.
Tom Servo: No, he smells like apples.
- MST3K

 

#154 2003-06-27 18:27:00

Damon
Pilgrim
From: enzed
Registered: 2001-05-31
Posts: 10673
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

Yep, Potemkin.


Damon.co.nz: Where the homeless come to bathe
"Pardon me while I have a strange interlude."

 

#155 2003-06-27 18:27:00

bandit
Pilgrim
From: Auckland
Registered: 2002-11-13
Posts: 4134
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

Okay then I'll give Rabbit Proof Fence another go. Um, much later when I've grown a thicker skin.


Crow: I think Ray Liotta would make an okay werewolf.
Tom Servo: No, he smells like apples.
- MST3K

 

#156 2003-06-29 21:56:00

Damon
Pilgrim
From: enzed
Registered: 2001-05-31
Posts: 10673
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

Watched Tim Burton's Ed Wood and Ed Wood's Plan 9 from Outer Space last night. Oh my, they were fantastic!


Damon.co.nz: Where the homeless come to bathe
"Pardon me while I have a strange interlude."

 

#157 2003-06-29 23:37:00

Tiny
Pilgrim
From: New Zealand
Registered: 2001-06-01
Posts: 723

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

It never gets old:

Greetings, my friends. We are all interested in the future, for that is where you and I are going to spend the rest of our lives.
And remember, my friends, future events such as these will affect you in the future...

 

#158 2003-06-30 05:24:00

Damon
Pilgrim
From: enzed
Registered: 2001-05-31
Posts: 10673
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

The quotations in that film have so many unintentional howlers it's fantastic.

"Then they attacked a town. A small town, I'll admit, but nevertheless a town of people. People who died."

"I'll bet we haven't seen the last of these weirdies."


Damon.co.nz: Where the homeless come to bathe
"Pardon me while I have a strange interlude."

 

#159 2003-06-30 09:00:00

Jaime
Pilgrim
From: Wilmington, NC
Registered: 2001-06-01
Posts: 11534

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

I wonder if the writers for the original Resident Evil got their inspiration from that movie.  hehehe.


Yield to temptation; it may not pass your way again.

-- Heinlein

 

#160 2003-06-30 14:32:00

bandit
Pilgrim
From: Auckland
Registered: 2002-11-13
Posts: 4134
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

I wanna see Plan 9. I think it was MST3Ked at some point, so maybe I have already seen it.


Crow: I think Ray Liotta would make an okay werewolf.
Tom Servo: No, he smells like apples.
- MST3K

 

#161 2003-06-30 16:49:00

Damon
Pilgrim
From: enzed
Registered: 2001-05-31
Posts: 10673
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

I don't think it has been. Far too easy. But yes, you need to see it, it's sublime.


Damon.co.nz: Where the homeless come to bathe
"Pardon me while I have a strange interlude."

 

#162 2003-06-30 17:09:00

bandit
Pilgrim
From: Auckland
Registered: 2002-11-13
Posts: 4134
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

My bad, it was Manos I was thinking of. But both were on your 100 Worst films link in the xeno.


Crow: I think Ray Liotta would make an okay werewolf.
Tom Servo: No, he smells like apples.
- MST3K

 

#163 2003-07-03 17:01:00

Damon
Pilgrim
From: enzed
Registered: 2001-05-31
Posts: 10673
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

I wanna see the Manos MST3K, if only to behold the mighty Torgo!

Anyway, this last week I have watched the following:
Keaton's The Love Nest
Keaton & Arbuckle's Good Night Nurse and Out West
Ozu's Banshun (Late Spring)
Renoir's Une Partie de Campagne (A Day in the Country)
Truffaut's Jules et Jim
Fellini's La Strada
Rossellini and Fellini's Il Miracolo (The Miracle) from L'Amour
Bergman's Smultronstället (Wild Strawberries)

Watched the Bergman last night, and it blew me away. Wow.

This week will be some D. W. Griffith, more Renoir, more Truffaut, that Russian one, and some Satyajit Ray.


Damon.co.nz: Where the homeless come to bathe
"Pardon me while I have a strange interlude."

 

#164 2003-07-03 18:00:00

Damon
Pilgrim
From: enzed
Registered: 2001-05-31
Posts: 10673
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

'kay, changed my mind on the Renoir and the Truffaut - I'll catch them later. Instead, this week it'll be Satyajit Ray, Murnau, Duvivier, Eisenstein, Griffith, Huston, and Lang.


Damon.co.nz: Where the homeless come to bathe
"Pardon me while I have a strange interlude."

 

#165 2003-07-04 07:54:00

Captain Roberto Fruitbat
Pilgrim
From: Berlin
Registered: 2001-06-08
Posts: 1314

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

Watch out when further exploring Bergmanīs oeuvre. He underwent some kind of major change around 1960 when he started working with Sven Nyquist. Many of his post 1960 films are very very bleak and pessimistic. Donīt watch when feeling down or in a bad mood. ;)

Did you get Pepe le Moko by Duvivier? Jean Gabin rules!

My favorite John Huston films apart from the really well known ones like The Maltese Falcon and Treasure of the Sierra Madre are Moby Dick and The Man Who Would Be King. Moby Dick impressed me because it felt so real - with good reason. After all they really did go whale hunting and then filmed it. Compared to someone like Huston, James Cameron is practically a wimp, hehe.

Btw, are John Ford and Howard Hawks also on your agenda?

As far as Fritz Lang is concerned, in a way I like his american films a bit more than the early german ones. They are more restrained and have a bigger emotional impact I think because the characters tend to be less superhuman. Favorites here being M, You Only Live Once and The Big Heat.

How did you like Jules et Jim?


insects are not always
going to be bullied
by humanity
some day they will revolt
i am already organizing
a revolutionary society to be
known as the worms turnverein

 

#166 2003-07-04 08:34:00

Damon
Pilgrim
From: enzed
Registered: 2001-05-31
Posts: 10673
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

Wild Strawberries is the only Bergman film I have access to; he's not at all easy to find around here. And sometimes you need to go with bleak.

It is Pepe Le Moko.

Seen The Maltese Falcon already, but this time I'm watching The African Queen.

I have hardly started on the American directors yet, although I would like to track down The Big Sleep in particular. Which Ford do you most recommend?

There's precious little Lang available, and precious time to watch them now, so I've elected to start with his most famous works: M and Metropolis. Although I'm having a terrible time finding a good copy of the latter - so many versions, so many bad versions!

Problem is that I can only watch those films that are available through the local Uni library, and that for not much longer.


Damon.co.nz: Where the homeless come to bathe
"Pardon me while I have a strange interlude."

 

#167 2003-07-04 08:37:00

Damon
Pilgrim
From: enzed
Registered: 2001-05-31
Posts: 10673
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

Oh, and Jules et Jim was excellent, although I'm very mad at all of them right now. Those moments when the frame pauses as if a picture has been taken - is that a Truffaut-specific characteristic? It felt like a director's trademark.


Damon.co.nz: Where the homeless come to bathe
"Pardon me while I have a strange interlude."

 

#168 2003-07-04 08:50:00

Captain Roberto Fruitbat
Pilgrim
From: Berlin
Registered: 2001-06-08
Posts: 1314

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

The freeze frame thing is indeed a Truffaut trademark, used for the first time and most famously in the final scene of Les Quatre Cents Coups. I must have seen both that and Jules et Jim at least a dozen times by now, I never get tired of them.

Iīll get back to you on John Ford later, I got to go out and buy some food first. Stock up for the weekend and avoid the rush tomorrow so I can go sightseeing in peace. :)

[ July 04, 2003: Message edited by: Harvey 2.0 ]


insects are not always
going to be bullied
by humanity
some day they will revolt
i am already organizing
a revolutionary society to be
known as the worms turnverein

 

#169 2003-07-04 08:53:00

Damon
Pilgrim
From: enzed
Registered: 2001-05-31
Posts: 10673
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

Well, the 400 Blows I won't be watching for a couple of weeks yet at least. Where are you going siteseeing? Urp, I guess you'll answer that when you get back.


Damon.co.nz: Where the homeless come to bathe
"Pardon me while I have a strange interlude."

 

#170 2003-07-04 13:59:00

Captain Roberto Fruitbat
Pilgrim
From: Berlin
Registered: 2001-06-08
Posts: 1314

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

Ok, the threat of starvation has been averted and I also had to watch the Simpsons and Enterprise.

About John Ford, looking at whatīs available at the library, Iīd say get all of them. Definitely Stagecoach and The Grapes of Wrath or My Darling Clementine. THE John Ford film to see, The Searchers doesnīt seem to be in the library. That one is a must.

Others:
The Iron Horse
The Informer
Drums Along the Mohawk
Young Mister Lincoln
The Long Voyage Home
How Green Was My Valley
They Were Expendable
Fort Apache
Ahe Wore a Yellow Ribbon
Wagon Master
Rio Grande
Three Godfathers
The Quiet Man
The Horse Soldiers
Sergeant Rutledge
Two Rode Together
The Man Who Shot Liberty Valence
Cheyenne Autumn

Itīs John Ford so the list is kinda long.
Get The Searcher, no matter how. Rob, kill or steal if necessary. :)

As a kind of companion piece to Fordīs work thereīd be Howard Hawks who also made some famous westerns but has a very different approach to things. Here the must see movie would be Rio Bravo which isnīt in the library but they do have Red River. Also at the library, Bringing up Baby and His Girl Friday. If you have to chose, get His Girl Friday, the fastest screwball comedy ever made.
The Big Sleep, To Have and Have Not and Only Angels have Wings are also essential viewing. The last one especially is a prime example of the group spirit thatīs at the core of many of Hawksīs films. Rio Bravo represents it in itīs purest form. What I said about The Searchers also applies to Rio Bravo. Rob, kill or steal ...

Then thereīs Hatari, one of the most fun movies ever. And it is available on DVD in the US, hehe, Iīm getting out my credit card to order it this very moment.

Another random recommendation, because I just remembered. Imitation of Life by Douglas Sirk. The Apotheosis of the melodrama, a film that caused streams of tears sufficient to turn the Sahara into an ocean. Seriously.

About the sightseeing/siteseeing, apart from film another of my interests is architecture. With our history and since half of Berlin has been turned into a construction site over the last 10 or 12 years, thereīs plenty to see. From 19th century Gründerzeit buildings, the Neue Sachlichkeit of the 20s and 30s, Nazi architecture, west german postwar monstrosities (the 70s were the pits), east german postwar monstrosities (the infamous Plattenbauten) and 80s postmodernism to the hightech architecture of the 90s.

Some major projects are still under construction while in the eastern part many streets and neighbourhoods that were in a delipidated state after decades of neglect have now been restored to their former glory.

So sometimes I just take my camera and spend an afternoon wandering around or checking out the progress at the main construction sites in the city. Now it just has to stop raining and I can go check out the Ackerstrasse tomorrow.

And that was probably a lot more than you really wanted to know.

(dang typos - time for a cup of tea now)

[ July 04, 2003: Message edited by: Harvey 2.0 ]


insects are not always
going to be bullied
by humanity
some day they will revolt
i am already organizing
a revolutionary society to be
known as the worms turnverein

 

#171 2014-04-17 18:42:58

bandit
Pilgrim
From: Auckland
Registered: 2002-11-13
Posts: 4134
Website

Re: The Art of Rhetoric

LOLOLOLOLOL forever @ this place. I remember when we used to get all politically het up and I was like "Right, there needs to be structure man so we can communicate!" and then I looked up the rules for formal debate (which were too complicated but sounded awesome) and then I was like "I'll totes summarize these later!" and then I never did and then we talked about old movies. GOOD TIMES.

PS I apologize to anyone who read my young-20s self being political. Nothing is a more hilarious mixture than being young, being in university, and having access to the internet. "WAIT YOU HAVEN'T HEARD MY IDEAS!!!!!"


Crow: I think Ray Liotta would make an okay werewolf.
Tom Servo: No, he smells like apples.
- MST3K

 

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